Why Raven isn't interested in developing Hexen III?

Talk about Hexen in general, books, fanfic, the original games etc..
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b0rsuk
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Re: Why Raven isn't interested in developing Hexen III?

Postby b0rsuk » Sun Nov 14, 2010 6:37 am


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Re: Why Raven isn't interested in developing Hexen III?

Postby mr.math » Sun Nov 14, 2010 8:39 am


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Re: Why Raven isn't interested in developing Hexen III?

Postby b0rsuk » Sun Nov 14, 2010 10:57 am

mr.math:

You're asking why nobody makes fantasy first person shooters anymore.
There are several reasons for this, and I'm probably missing a couple.

- melee weapons are not easy to translate into a FPS game. Heretic did that, Hexen did that, but can you honestly say it's satisfactory ? In Heretic they're last resort, in Hexen fists and axe are okay, but the mace is terrible. And this is a problem, because Sapphire Wand and Spiked Gauntlets are weapons other classes can envy. At least there are situations where you can say "I wish I had weapon X instead !". Rune had melee weapons and could be played in in first person mode, but it looked bad that way.

- (related to the above) I have yet to see a satisfactory implementation of shields in a game, not to mention FPS game.

- Fantasy games require more imagination than a ww2 or contemporary war shooters. Modern or quasi-modern shooters require no imagination. They're risk free.

- Computers used to be the domain of geeks, and technical people. Nowadays most of them are used by people who openly state they don't like computers. There's a synergy between geeks/techies and fantasy. As "casual users" become more and more dominant in terms of numbers, game developers and especially publishers seek to satisfy the masses. I'm a Computer Science graduate and I perceive the world, computers and games differently than people who oscillate between parties, cinema and football/basketball.

- there was World War Two, but there was no Fantasy War Two. WW2 is a huge source of inspiration. You can have athmospheric and very polished weapons that feel quite different from what is used today. You have heaps of sources, concept art, recordings. Many games have guns that feel right and have a punch to them (some examples: I like the machinegun from Half-Life 1, chaingun from DooM 3...). Meanwhile weapons in fantasy or futuristic* settings often trigger the dreaded "pew pew !" reaction. They may look pretty, but they rarely have weapons which look like they could really harm people. This isn't surprising considering there's no huge source of material for fantasy and futuristic settings (like WW2 and even modern wars).

* I call them futuristic because science fiction is based in science and shouldn't be confused with Star Wars
There's yet hope. Brink attempts some rather innovative things with movement.

I think that to really create a game where melee weapons are interesting developers would need to experiment with an alternate control system. Keyboard+Mouse works for modern shooters because in essence guns are simple things. You attempt to point the gun or rifle at the target and press the button. Melee weapons are much more complex. You need more precision to control that. I'm not a fan of console controllers or consoles in general, I have another idea instead:

Mouse+Mouse control. Left mouse for movement, right mouse for handling the (usually melee) weapon. This would come at a price (less keys, but there are certainly multi-button mice!), but has potential to really shake things up. You can take two 3-button 2-wheel mice for granted.
So, who's with me to develop a Mouse+Mouse fantasy FPS ? No one ? Thought so :|.

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Re: Why Raven isn't interested in developing Hexen III?

Postby deadite4 » Sun Nov 14, 2010 1:46 pm

There's always risk when your dealing with $100 million dollars and up of development costs.

I've heard fantastic things on Singularity.
Sounds Great. Do it again.

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Re: Why Raven isn't interested in developing Hexen III?

Postby Icetigris » Mon Nov 15, 2010 9:38 pm

I actually talked to a guy from Raven recently, and it's not that they don't want to make a new Hexen or Heretic (on the contrary, they would love to make another one), it's that there are issues over the intellectual property rights ownership. IP stuff ruins everything in the game industry :<

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Re: Why Raven isn't interested in developing Hexen III?

Postby b0rsuk » Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:10 am

I don't believe it. In any case, if they remake Hexen it will probably be a First Person S... Oh, wait.

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Re: Why Raven isn't interested in developing Hexen III?

Postby ShadesMaster » Wed Nov 17, 2010 3:03 pm

At this moment, when hearing about the Raven news... economy. Seems the best bet is for people to pump effort into a free resource pack....

Of course, when a certain someone goes viral on youtube (and hey, to pitch an idea to a real tv show to a network is better if u actually have stuff to show), we can actually pay ppl to make resources... but how would that work on a property ownership level? We did not come up with the idea of HeXen... we'd still be giving money not getting any but still, I imagine legal intricacies if ANY monetary exchange is involved....

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Re: Why Raven isn't interested in developing Hexen III?

Postby RaVeN » Wed Mar 30, 2011 11:36 am

Raven Software
We've recently been talking about some of our early games here at Raven - how many remember Hexen, Heretic, or our very first game Black Crypt?

http://www.facebook.com/#!/ravensoftwar ... 7277810061





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Re: Why Raven isn't interested in developing Hexen III?

Postby deadite4 » Thu Mar 31, 2011 9:38 pm

Heh, pretty cool. I've actually recently started playing Hexen 1.
Sounds Great. Do it again.

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Re: Why Raven isn't interested in developing Hexen III?

Postby Naglfar » Tue Apr 12, 2011 12:45 am


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Re: Why Raven isn't interested in developing Hexen III?

Postby Caffeine Freak » Wed Apr 13, 2011 6:59 pm

Regarding Raven 'lacking invention'... the same thing could be argued for practically any major studio. You could make the same case about id(Doom and Quake), Epic(Unreal and Gears of War), Rockstar(GTA), and Infinity Ward(Call of Duty). All of these studios have produced tons of sequels for these sure-fire games. Not that there's anything wrong with it, I'm just saying.

I recall a quote by John Carmack from a key note speech several years back, something like this:

"The gaming industry is very risk-averse right now, and it's for darn good reasons... And people will always complain, 'Oh, why can't the industry do something original, something innovative...' And y'know, it's all well and good to say when it's not your twenty million dollars that it's gonna take to develop that new title."
Yep, time for another Doom fix.

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Re: Why Raven isn't interested in developing Hexen III?

Postby BloodRayne » Tue May 17, 2011 8:01 am

Singularity was pretty unique, and a new IP from Raven. :)
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